OT: Recording a Choir!!!!!
Posted: Wed Jul 27, 2011 2:26 amGuys,
Firstly let me say, I think the person concerned is VERY wrong --- or is it me!!!!!!!!!
Last week I was attending an audio/lighting/staging exhibition/conference and as part of this (I had a bit of spare time), I decided to attend one of the seminars that were being run.
The seminar was on tips for the home/project studio owner (a console and hardware recorder were not mentioned once, everything was either Protools or Logic). The seminar's presenters (I believe) were a couple of lecturers from a private audio school or similar --- whatever, they presented themselves as God's gift to the music industry.
At the conclusion of the presentation, attendees were invited to ask questions. One question asked was "how would you suggest recording a choir (say in a school hall) without every member of the choir wearing headphones to hear the previously recorded music backing track". Quite an interesting question and one that made me think.
The answer given (and what I disagree with) was as follows:
"Set two mics in MS/XY or whatever fashion best suites the location and choir, then place a foldback speaker on the floor directly below or evenly spaced between the microphone stands (in the case of spaced left/right mic placement), now raise the level of the foldback just enough to be compfortably heard by the choir and do the recording. On playback you will hear the foldback quite clearly in the mix. Now, without adjusting any levels of foldback or microphone or without moving anything, undertake a second recording of the choir.
After the second recording, when playing back the two recorded tracks, place one of the tracks out of phase and raise the level of both faders to the same position. You will now find that the sound from the foldback speaker is cancelled out, now you can raise the level of the previously recorded backing track and all will be perfect.
You can continue to record this way for other parts of the choir (ie undertake harmony parts, etc), provided you always record the part twice and then place one recording out of phase."
Now, if I am correct, the lecturer has no idea what he is talking about and what are the students (who would be paying big money for the course) being taught and what would be their ability when released into the world of sound recording???????????????
If the choir sings the same part twice (I realise that there will always be slight differences in vocal phrasing, timing, etc), wont all of the choir -- or at least a good part of it, also be out of phase and cancel out, or at least have a lot of phasing problems with the end result sounding s*#t, and with the more takes recorded adding to the problem when all the recorded tracks are mixed. I would also presume that the problem would be even worse if the final product was mixed or played back in Mono?
David
Firstly let me say, I think the person concerned is VERY wrong --- or is it me!!!!!!!!!
Last week I was attending an audio/lighting/staging exhibition/conference and as part of this (I had a bit of spare time), I decided to attend one of the seminars that were being run.
The seminar was on tips for the home/project studio owner (a console and hardware recorder were not mentioned once, everything was either Protools or Logic). The seminar's presenters (I believe) were a couple of lecturers from a private audio school or similar --- whatever, they presented themselves as God's gift to the music industry.
At the conclusion of the presentation, attendees were invited to ask questions. One question asked was "how would you suggest recording a choir (say in a school hall) without every member of the choir wearing headphones to hear the previously recorded music backing track". Quite an interesting question and one that made me think.
The answer given (and what I disagree with) was as follows:
"Set two mics in MS/XY or whatever fashion best suites the location and choir, then place a foldback speaker on the floor directly below or evenly spaced between the microphone stands (in the case of spaced left/right mic placement), now raise the level of the foldback just enough to be compfortably heard by the choir and do the recording. On playback you will hear the foldback quite clearly in the mix. Now, without adjusting any levels of foldback or microphone or without moving anything, undertake a second recording of the choir.
After the second recording, when playing back the two recorded tracks, place one of the tracks out of phase and raise the level of both faders to the same position. You will now find that the sound from the foldback speaker is cancelled out, now you can raise the level of the previously recorded backing track and all will be perfect.
You can continue to record this way for other parts of the choir (ie undertake harmony parts, etc), provided you always record the part twice and then place one recording out of phase."
Now, if I am correct, the lecturer has no idea what he is talking about and what are the students (who would be paying big money for the course) being taught and what would be their ability when released into the world of sound recording???????????????
If the choir sings the same part twice (I realise that there will always be slight differences in vocal phrasing, timing, etc), wont all of the choir -- or at least a good part of it, also be out of phase and cancel out, or at least have a lot of phasing problems with the end result sounding s*#t, and with the more takes recorded adding to the problem when all the recorded tracks are mixed. I would also presume that the problem would be even worse if the final product was mixed or played back in Mono?
David
I almost went to one of those schools.......glad I opted for real world experience instead if thats whats being taught.
I've never tried to do M/S with a choir set up, but I can see the concern with the bleed. But maybe since the Side mic is in fig8 it will already have a nice amount of rejection to start with. The mid might be the one that would give any problems. This is all theoretical until attempted of course.