I added a MIDI merge box and a MIDI splitter cable to the setup a few days ago, and finally got that part working.
Since my setup is getting increasingly complex, I wanted to document this for myself, so I can always go back and look it up, in case I need to disconnect something for whatever reason (e.g. remove and open a console for troubleshooting… so I remember how to hook it back up, without having to think through the signal flow on every wire again while connecting). I figured that it might be useful for others here, if I share my setup documentation. Just in case someone else wants to run two D8Bs with a single HDR, all synced to a DAW running on the computer.
I thought of doing a diagram, but that would take hours… so, here’s a simple I/O connection list for each unit.
I hope this turns out to be useful for someone, if you decide to go with a similar setup. Here we go:
Synced Dual D8B/Single-HDR/Computer Setup:
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MIDI:
Computer (Mac OS, via Emagic Unitor 8):
MIDI Out —> to MIDI Merge Box In 1
MIDI In <— from HDR Out (from splitter cable out 1)
MIDI Merge Box (MIDI Solutions Quadra Merge):
MIDI Out1—> to HDR In
MIDI Out2—> to D8B 1 (Main) In
MIDI In 1 <— from Computer Out
MIDI In 2 <— from D8B 1 (Main) Out
MIDI In 3 <— from D8B 2 (Submix) Out
MIDI In 4 <— (unused)
HDR:
MIDI Out (via Splitter cable out 1) —> to Computer MIDI In (via Unitor 8)
MIDI Out (via Splitter cable out 2) —> to D8B 2 (Submix) MIDI In
MIDI In <— from MIDI Merge Box Out 1
D8B 1 (Main):
MIDI Out —> to MIDI Merge Box In 2
MIDI In <— from MIDI Merge Box Out 2
D8B 2 (Submix):
MIDI Out —> to MIDI Merge Box In 3
MIDI In <— from HDR splitter cable out 2
A note about the above:
- For some reason, connecting the HDR MIDI Out directly to the Merge Box, will result in failure to sync the computer, and MMC (Transport Buttons) not working as expected. Not sure why (duplicated MIDI, and/or MIDI Feedback Loops, probably).
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Word Clock:
Computer (Mac OS, via Universal Audio Apollo 8 Audio Interface - Word Clock MASTER):
WC Out (Terminated) —> to HDR WC In
WC In <— (unused)
HDR (Word Clock SLAVE):
WC Out —> to D8B 1 (Main) Word Clock In (via T-Connector on modded, UNTERMINATED Apogee Clock Card In)
WC In <— from Audio Interface Word Clock Out (UA Apollo 8 in my case)
D8B 1 (Main - Word Clock SLAVE):
WC Out (Apogee Clock Card) —> (unused)
WC In (modded, UNTERMINATED Apogee Clock Card - via one end of T-Connector) <— from HDR Word Clock Out
WC In (modded, UNTERMINATED Apogee Clock card - via OTHER end of T-Conector) —> to D8B 2 Word Clock in (via regular TERMINATED Apogee Clock Card In)
(The above may seem confusing, as it looks like the D8B 1 WC 'In' sends WC 'out' to D8B 2, but it doesn’t. With the T-Connector, the WC signal enters the D8B 1 In, and passes through the T-Connector on the outside and also reaches D8B 2 In. So, the same WC signal coming from the HDR, feeds D8B 1 AND D8B 2).
D8B 2 (Submix - Word Clock SLAVE):
WC Out —> (unused)
WC In (via regular TERMINATED Apogee Clock Card In) <— from D8B 1 (Main - via T-Connector on modded, UNTERMINATED “In” connector on Apogee Clock Card)
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Digital Audio (ADAT):
Computer (Mac OS, via Universal Audio Apollo 8 Audio Interface - Word Clock MASTER):
ADAT Out —> to D8B 2 (Submix) Alt I/O 1-8 In
ADAT In <— from D8B 1 (Main) Alt I/O 1-8 Out
HDR (Word Clock SLAVE, via 3x DIO8):
ADAT Out 1 —> to D8B 1 (Main) Tape In/Return 1-8
ADAT In 1 <— from D8B 1 (Main) Tape Out 1-8
ADAT Out 2 —> to D8B 1 (Main) Tape In/Return 9-16
ADAT In 2 <— from D8B 1 (Main) Tape Out 9-16
ADAT Out 3 —> to D8B 1 (Main) Tape In/Return 17-24
ADAT In 3 <— from D8B 1 (Main) Tape Out 17-24
D8B 1 (Main - Word Clock SLAVE, via 4x DIO8):
ADAT Out 1 (Tape 1-8) —> to HDR ADAT In 1-8
ADAT In 1 (Tape 1-8) <— from HDR ADAT Out 1-8
ADAT Out 2 (Tape 9-16) —> to HDR ADAT In 9-16
ADAT In 2 (Tape 9-16) <— from HDR ADAT Out 9-16
ADAT Out 3 (Tape 17-24) —> to HDR ADAT In 17-24
ADAT In 3 (Tape 17-24) <— from HDR ADAT Out 17-24
ADAT Out 4 (Alt I/O 1-8) —> to Computer Audio Interface ADAT In (Apollo 8, in my case)
ADAT In 4 (Alt I/O 1-8) <— from D8B 2 (Submix) Alt I/O 1-8 Out
D8B 2 (Submix - Word Clock SLAVE, , via 4x DIO8)):
ADAT Out 1 (Tape 1-8) —> (unused)
ADAT In 1 (Tape 1-8) <— (unused)
ADAT Out 2 (Tape 9-16) —> (unused)
ADAT In 2 (Tape 9-16) <— (unused)
ADAT Out 3 (Tape 17-24) —> (unused)
ADAT In 3 (Tape 17-24) <— (unused)
ADAT Out 4 (Alt I/O 1-8) —> to D8B 1 (Main) Alt I/O 1-8 In
ADAT In 4 (Alt I/O 1-8) <— from Computer Audio Interface ADAT Out (Apollo 8, in my case)
A couple of notes about the above:
- This is a simplified representation of my setup. Audio Interface ADAT I/O, HDR ADAT I/O and the “unused” ADAT I/O from D8B 2 (Submix) go to a digital patchbay, to allow more flexible routing between units. This is too complex to represent in the way I do here (and honestly, I rarely change the routing at the digital patchbay).
- The default routing above makes sense for my workflow, but might not for yours. My workflow includes bringing home a drive caddy from another HDR (really an MDR), that I’m using to record to 24 Tracks in the rehearsal room, so I can rough-mix directly on the “main” D8B1 without having to copy to the computer. Or alternatively, I can digitally transfer to the computer via ADAT optical, 8 channels at a time if I want to (but I usually just render the tracks and copy them to the computer instead).
- One of the main reasons why I run a second D8B, is not to expand my track count (otherwise, I’d use my second HDR/MDR at home), but to get more Line-Inputs for all my synths and external gear, so I don’t have to physically re-patch when I want to use them. I have additional synths etc. connected to the inputs on D8B2, and (sub-)mix via the 8-Bus/Alt-IO into the first D8B. If I want to record from D8B2 to the computer, I route individual channels (or 8 at a time) from D8B2 that arrive at D8B1 via the Alt-I/O, back out to the Tape Outs on D8B1, to go to the Computer Audio Interface’s ADAT In (since it’s digital all the way, there is no loss).
- Via the MIDI setup above, the DAW on the computer, and the HDR/D8B’s all sync together via MTC (MIDI Time Code), and the transport controls work to controls the setup from everywhere (DAW, HDR, D8Bs), via MMC (MIDI Machine Control). So, digital transfers are synced to the project tempo etc., and I can use the 24 HDR tracks alongside the computer tracks if desired.
- I rarely need to return signals from the Computer Audio Interface (via ADAT) back to the D8B, since I’m not using it for mixdowns. That’s why a return of the Computer to the Alt I/O on D8B is sufficient. However, full disclosure is, that I usually have the computer return patched to Tape In 17-24 on D8B2 via the Digital Patchbay (I just thought this might make things look more confusing in the I/O chart above, triggering some “why?” questions. Mostly just so I get effects if I want, and because the Tape In layer is just that - and I look at the computer a bit like a tape machine for this scenario. Besides, it's less confusing to me, than having these channels as 8 Alt-I/O returns on a shared layer with the (virtual) Effect Returns etc on the D8B.
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Digital Audio (S/PDIF & AES/EBU):
Computer (Mac OS, via Universal Audio Apollo 8 Audio Interface - Word Clock MASTER):
S/PDIF Out —> to D8B 1 (Main) S/PDIF In
S/PDIF In <— from D8B 1 (Main) S/PDIF Out (Mirroring Master Output)
HDR (N/A - only digital connections are via ADAT & Word Clock):
D8B 1 (Main - Word Clock SLAVE):
AES/EBU Out —> to D8B 2 (Submix) AES/EBU In
AES/EBU In <— from D8B 2 (Submix) AES/EBU Out
S/PDIF Out —> to Audio Interface S/PDIF In (Main Mix of HDR and both D8Bs).
S/PDIF In <— from Audio Interface S/PDIF Out (to be able to route full Mix or individual signals from Computer back to D8B. Careful - feedback loop risk!)
D8B 2 (Submix - Word Clock SLAVE):
AES/EBU Out —> to D8B 1 (Main) AES/EBU In
AES/EBU In <— from D8B 1 (Main) AES/EBU Out
S/PDIF Out —> (unused)
S/PDIF In <— (unused)
A couple of notes about the above:
- I do not use the D8B Monitoring section(s). I use a separate Mackie Big Knob for that, that receives it’s main signal directly from my Audio Interface (Apollo 8, Main Out). Signals from the HDR/D8B2 are mixed down via the D8B1, and output to the Apollo 8 via S/PDIF. They’re mixed to the audio interfaces main out without latency, via the interfaces built in Console/Mixer.
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General Notes:
- I also have a ProBox connected to each of the two D8B units, with an external switch-box for each, that allows to switch from Mixer-Operation, to Control Surface Operation (the mixers still pass audio when used as a control surface, but you can’t control anything while in that mode - neither from the user interface, nor from the console(s)). I primarily use D8B 2 in “Control Surface” mode with Logic, since it’s just my “sub-mixer", and have this unit configured to dynamically switch the fader and V-Pot assignments via the dedicated buttons (e.g. Audio Track Layer, Instruments Layer, Aux/Bus Layer, Outputs Layer, etc) when in Control Surface mode. I applied labels for all the master-section controls on D8B 2, that indicate what these do in control surface mode (works like a Mackie Control + 2 Extenders). If I need a reminder what the mixer-operation functions are, I just peek at D8B 1.
- I occasionally switch both D8B units to Control Surface mode (mainly during “in-the-box” mixdowns), and for this, have Logic configured to have permanent/static assignments on D8B 1, controlling Auxes/Busses, VCAs, Audio Interface Outputs (i.e. level control for “sends” to outboard gear), etc.. D8B 2 in controller mode reacts to assignments dynamically as described above. Keeping D8B 1 on a static assignment via my templates in Logic, eliminates the guessing game which fader does what (the faders are labeled for that, on the scribble strip). I have a 40” monitor above D8B 2, and the channels on the console and the monitor align pretty well, making it easier to figure out what’s on which channel (and Logic switches the display of channels on the monitor, along with what’s controlled on D8B 2).
- To round out what the D8Bs can do in Control Surface Mode, I have an additional Mackie C4 sitting to the right of the consoles, that has 4 banks of 8 V-Pots, and displays for each bank of 8 pots. I usually operate this, to give me a “channel strip” view of the selected channel. This is really useful, as it gives shows these parameters for the selected channel:
Top row of 8 V-Pots/Displays: 4-Band EQ (Frequency+Gain for each)
2nd row of 8 V-Pots/Displays: DAW Insert/Plug-In display/selector for channel for first 8 slots (pushing V-Pot opens GUI)
3rd row of 8 V-Pots/Displays: Aux Sends 1-8 Levels
4th row of 8 V-Pots/Displays: Channel Output Assign, Automation Controls, Track Volume, Pan, etc.
(Of course the C4 can also be switched to control other things in Logic, such as directly recalling 32 Marker points amongst other things).
- I use a Protec Bytelan KVM to control both D8Bs and the HDR via a single Monitor and keyboard/mouse combo. This KVM has 4 ports. Technically, I only use it to switch keyboard & mouse, though, not the monitor. For monitor switching, I use a 2nd KVM, since that other KVM only has USB (which I need for something else), but has a PS2 In in addition to the USB in (cheap Chinese non-name KVM I already had). The way I have everything wired, I can use the same AT/PS2 keyboard/mouse combo to control both D8Bs, the HDR and a secondary computer (an old Mac Mini), that I occasionally need for my day-job. How I have this wired to function is fairly complex, though, and would require a separate posting. Of course all this would be much simpler, if I’d just spend the money and get a 4 Port KVM that does AT, PS/2 and USB at the same time.
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I think that wraps up the main points of my setup around the D8Bs. I hope this is useful for someone else as well
